“Where did the idea that the Book of Mormon occurred in central America originate? What historical evidence from Joseph Smith exists to support the many Mesoamerica theories speculating about its geography? Where did the Book of Mormon history really take place and what did the Prophet, Joseph Smith, know about it, if anything? BYU law school graduate, former JAG attorney and author Jonathan Neville has conducted one of the most important, monumental and history clarifying research on these subjects. His research has culminated in one of the most important books on the Book of Mormon that has been written, a book that will finally lay to rest speculation about where to complete our search for the evidence of the reality of the Book of Mormon, a book that reveals new research that is destined to become… THE SMOKING GUN OF BOOK OF MORMON GEOGRAPHY… The book is called “The Lost City of Zarahemla” – Rod Meldrum
Our two friends, Stephen Reed from Mesa, AZ and Jonathan Neville have answered where this convoluted theory of having a Hill Cumorah in NY and one somewhere in Mexico came from. Obviously JF Smith new what was correct and here are many, many other quotes from Prophets and Apostles that conclude there is only one Hill Cumorah in NY. List Here
Why do you think Joseph Fielding Smith this?
“…This modernistic theory of necessity, in order to be consistent, must place the waters of Ripliancum and the Hill Cumorah some place within the restricted territory of Central America, notwithstanding the teachings of the Church to the contrary for upwards of 100 years. Because of this theory [M2C] some members of the Church have become confused and greatly disturbed in their faith in the Book of Mormon. It is for this reason that evidence is here presented to show that it is not only possible that these places could be located as the Church has held during the past century, but that in very deed such is the case… It is known that the Hill Cumorah where the Nephites were destroyed is the hill where the Jaredites were also destroyed. This hill was known to the Jaredites as Ramah. It was approximately near to the waters of Ripliancum, which the Book of Ether says, “by interpretation, is large, or to exceed all…
It must be conceded that this description fits perfectly the land of Cumorah in New York, as it has been known since the visitation of Moroni to the Prophet Joseph Smith, for the hill is in the proximity of the Great Lakes and also in the land of many rivers and fountains. Moreover, the Prophet Joseph Smith himself is on record, definitely declaring the present hill called Cumorah to be the exact hill spoken of in the Book of Mormon. Further, the fact that all of his associates from the beginning down have spoken of it as the identical hill where Mormon and Moroni hid the records, must carry some weight. It is difficult for a reasonable person to believe that such men as Oliver Cowdery. Brigham Young, Parley P. Pratt, Orson Pratt, David Whitmer, and many others, could speak frequently of the Spot where the Prophet Joseph Smith obtained the plates as the Hill Cumorah, and not be corrected by the Prophet, if that were not the fact. That they did speak of this hill in the days of the Prophet in this definite manner is an established record of history.” Doctrines of Salvation Joseph Fielding Smith Chapter 12
Apologetics
It is VERY sad that some many good faithful apologetic members are so adamant about there being two Cumorah’s, as many won’t let it go. Places like Book of Mormon Central, FAIR LDS, Meridian Magazine, and Interpreter Foundation, won’t even allow discussion about the Heartland Theory on their websites. That is silly. I feel the person who is willing to debate and shine a light on possibilities usually has a stronger case of truth. I sure don’t know everything and I am sure these others have great information on many church questions, but when it comes to the geography, I can’t believe much of what they say. I was in their camp for over 40 years and now it makes no sense at all to me. To each his own however. I am believing we all love the Book of Mormon truth, and that is most important. But I ask, Why won’t they discuss it openly with us?
Winchester Zealous Missionary
“Benjamin Winchester was a prolific early Mormon author and a zealous missionary for many years. He was a close friend of Joseph Smith’s. He went on Zion’s Camp when he was only 16 years old, along with his father. He was present when the original Quorum of the Twelve were called and ordained. He went on missions and vigorously defended the Church. He started his own newspaper in Philadelphia, the Gospel Reflector, and he moved to Nauvoo in 1841 to work at the Times and Seasons.
However, he resisted authority. He eventually turned against the Church.
A month before he died at Carthage, Joseph Smith said that Winchester had a rotten heart and would “injure the Church as much as he could.”
Few members of the Church today have ever heard of Benjamin Winchester. Even fewer know of Joseph’s prophecy about him.
Because that’s the case, how could Joseph’s prophecy be fulfilled?
My research into Church history led me to conclude that Joseph’s prophecy about Winchester was fulfilled by the development of the Mesoamerican/two-Cumorahs theory (M2C).” Jonathan Neville Read more here:
The Two Cumorah Solution by Stephen Reed
See Stephen’s Presentation – “The Two-Cumorah Solution for a Flawed Book of Mormon Geography Model: 1844 – 1924”
Subscription Members View Video Here:
“THE TWO-CUMORAH SOLUTION”
To Sign Up for a Membership Click Here:
As an Analyst for an International Bank for the past eleven years, Steve has a penchant for solving problems. He doesn’t accept the current dogma by Book of Mormon Scholars, despite their advanced degrees, claiming that the Prophet Joseph Smith learned the geography of The Book of Mormon from a travel book with pictures, published in 1842 by John Lloyd Stephens. (A travel book with pictures? Seriously? Is that the best analysis you’ve got?) Then Book of Mormon geography miraculously turned into a restricted Mesoamerica setting with the original Hill Cumorah, not in New York, but located somewhere in Central America. With extra time available by working from home during the 2020 Pandemic and while lounging on his sofa using an iPad and an Internet search engine, Steve learned the true origin of the Mesoamerica Two-Cumorah Geography theory for The Book of Mormon.
It’s simple. And it’s all online. All of it! You don’t need a library of scholarly books to understand it. In this simple analytical 40-minute presentation, Steve will cover an 80-year time period starting with the death of the Prophet Joseph Smith in 1844, who had nothing to do with the Two-Cumorah Theory for The Book of Mormon and ending in 1924. You will be shown how the Two-Cumorah idea was actually a solution for a previously flawed geography model which placed The Book of Mormon in Central and in South America. Watch this presentation. You will learn who actually created the Two-Cumorah Theory for The Book of Mormon. It may surprise you. You will also be able to access the same online documents Steve found, while lounging on your own sofa. It’s that easy. No scholars required. After completing a two-year mission in Venezuela, Steve returned to BYU and graduated with a degree in Business Management and Finance. He currently resides in Mesa, Arizona. Stephen would like to thank in advance, Jonathan Neville, for his kind encouragement and support. Brother Neville stated in an email: “You’ve done some great original research people need to know about.
The RLDS History Preceding M2C by Stephen Reed
“The history leading up to the Limited Geography Theory is intertwined with the history of The Reorganized Church.
In 1894, The RLDS Church created a “Committee on American Archaeology” which published a 184-Page Report with hemispheric maps in defense of The Book of Mormon. It can be found on line here with its maps:
https://play.google.com/books/reader?id=PXYoAAAAYAAJ&pg=GBS.PP1&hl=en
This Church with its believers in The Book of Mormon, falsely assumed The Book of Mormon occurred in both North, Central and South America. This was contrary to the teachings of The Prophet Joseph Smith and the Prophet Ether both who indicated the Center Place of Zion is The New Jerusalem located near Independence, Missouri.
Central America was falsely assumed to be the “narrow neck” of land. Both the lands of Zarahemla and Nephi were placed in South America, the north flowing Rio Magdalena in Colombia as the River Sidon, but with Cumorah correctly located in New York.
These maps were official RLDS doctrine, published and given to members of the RLDS Church, which caused confusion – The Land of Nephi and the land of Zarahemla were too far from Cumorah in New York.
This was noted in published RLDS documents, today found online. Members wrote complaining that King Limhi’s rescue party of 43 men could have not traveled as far as upstate New York, located the Prophet Ether’s 24 gold plates near the Hill Ramah (Cumorah), then returned again all the way to the Land of Nephi in South America without again encountering the nearby Land of Zarahemla, also in South America.
These RLDS documents can be found on my blog at: https://twocumorahsolution.blogspot.com
Also, it made no sense to RLDS members that the last Jaredite King, the injured Coriantumr, traveled to South America to encounter the people of Mulek, to live with them for only “nine moons.” Stephen Reed. See his complete article here: https://bookofmormonevidence.org/origin-of-m2c/
Neville’s Smoking Gun of Book of Mormon Geography
“What no one noticed before now was a number of similarities between the Mesoamerican articles and the known writings of one Benjamin Winchester. Words, phrases, and concepts were common to both sets of documents–and unique to Winchester.
Winchester, in fact, was the Smoking Gun of Mesoamerican theory.
This realization led to further inquiry. Who exactly was Benjamin Winchester? Why did he write these articles? How did he get them published in the Times and Seasons? What did Joseph Smith think of them?
Benjamin Winchester
Although he is mostly forgotten now, Benjamin Winchester was well known in the early days of the Church. He had been the youngest adult (age 16) on Zion’s Camp in 1834. He had been ordained an Elder and a Seventy by the age of 20. He had been present when the original members of the Quorum of the Twelve were chosen and ordained. Along with them, he had received a blessing and a promise that he “shall push many people to Zion.” In fulfillment of that blessing, he became a zealous missionary–successful enough that the Times and Seasons published an account of his missionary work in its very first issue in 1839.
Winchester settled down in Philadelphia, where he became the Branch President Presiding Elder (equivalent to today’s Bishop). Frustrated with the anti-Mormon opposition and the inadequate success of the missionary work, he started his own newspaper, called The Gospel Reflector, to promulgate his ideas about Church doctrine and the Book of Mormon, he developed a “new course of argument” that he believed would persuade the world to read the Book of Mormon and join the Church. A thrilling book by John L. Stephens, titled Incidents of Travel in Central America, Chiapas and Yucatan, was riveting readers with descriptions of an expedition that uncovered mysterious, long-lost civilizations. Accompanied by detailed illustrations of exotic ruins, the book became a national best seller. Winchester had previously sought to popularize the Book of Mormon by linking it to other books about archaeology, but the Stephens book was more sensational.
The Legacy
The conspiracy fomented by Benjamin Winchester and William Smith is not merely an interesting and previously unknown aspect of Church history. George J. Adams, a close associate of Joseph’s, wrote that shortly before their martyrdom, “Joseph and Hyrum said that Winchester was rotten at heart, would apostatize, and injure the church as much as he could.” But as noted at the outset, Winchester has been largely forgotten. Few people other than serious students of Church history have ever heard of him. Has Joseph’s prophecy been fulfilled? Has Winchester injured the church?
The answer comes back to Winchester’s three Mesoamerican articles in the Times and Seasons. Certainly they have had a major influence on the Church through Mesoamerican Book of Mormon theories ever since.
For 173 years, faithful Mormons have been searching in Mesoamerica for evidences of the Book of Mormon. Scientific expeditions have been conducted. Books have been published, films produced, tours undertaken, and artwork and photos created and displayed, not only in chapels and temples but in the pages of the Book of Mormon itself. And yet, after all this time, energy and expense, not a single piece of evidence of the Book of Mormon civilizations has been discovered in Mesoamerica. At best, scholars find parallels and similarities. They’ve made an honest and sincere–but terribly costly–mistake.
All because of one Benjamin Winchester.” Jonathan Neville; Complete article below.
Slanderous Benjamin Winchester
I just discovered some new information about Benjamin Winchester that helped me understand the nature of his heart. Here is a Letter below from Sybella McMinn Armstrong, 1 May 1843 about Benjamin Winchester [No spelling or edits were made below. Bold and Color added]
“Letter from Sybella McMinn Armstrong, 1 May 1843,” p. [4], The Joseph Smith Papers, accessed January 10, 2023, https://www.josephsmithpapers.org/paper-summary/letter-from-sybella-mcminn-armstrong-1-may-1843/4
President Joseph Smith, Dear Borether
It is with feelings of no ordinry nature that I adress the following lines to you— but a strong sense of duty to my-self and the causse of Christ alone prompts me, I appeal to you because you— your-self have felt the sting of Slander, and know how sha[r]per then a Serpents tooth it is— I appeal to you Sir because I know and believe you to be a Man endowed with a Strong sense of Justice! and that you have a disposition to administer the same to the wronged and oppressed! You may think strange that woman as I am I should appeal to You in this matter, I seek redress at the hands of the Chu[r]ch first because tis my dhutry [duty] so to do— others Counsel when direct[ed] it by the Chu[r]chs— When I uniteted myself with the Chu[r]ch of latter day Sa[in]ts God kn[o]ws so far as the world was concernd I parted with my Charctar— I was willing to have my name cast out as evil— and endure all manner of reproaches for the sake and cause of my Master— [p. [1]]
and suffer the loss of Family and Fr[ie]nds rather than not obey the Gospel of Christ! Yes sooner would I suffer my right Hand sevrd [severed] from my body then I would deny that God has spoken in these last dans [days]— I can endure all maner of scorn and disisern [derision?] from the world and Rejoice in it! but to have my Charactar stabbed in the dark and mutilated by a villain! in the Gard [garb?] of Righte[ou]sness is more than I can put down and truely bear! I seek not for vengence I ask it not— but in the name of the Lord I ask for Justice, for the deepest wrongs inflicted without the slightest provction [provocation]— but to be plain Benjamin Winchester has basicly Sla[n]dered my Charctar in Phila time oft and again, this I bore not satisfied with this he goes to New York and repprted me as being a str[u]mpet and that I was a wom[a]n of so notrietry but a Christin that I was kno[w]n to all the Captans on the Ohio and Missippie Rivers, nor is this all he represnted us as getting our livi[n]g by plucking the Public! Now Sir when he was brought to an acc[o]unt for these things did he deny it [p. [2]] https://www.josephsmithpapers.org/paper-summary/letter-from-sybella-mcminn-armstrong-1-may-1843/2
no! but with the most embar[ra]ssing affr[on]tery said he had been told so— but did he tell it for hear-say no! but took Go[o]d care to tell it as matter of fact— could he give his authors no but called on Mrs— Newton to say I had acted imprudntly with Brother [Orson] Hyde— and also my going on a visit to Jersey that I b[e]haved verry imprud[ent]ly with him ther, I appeal to Brother Hyde for the propriety of my connduct— with him at all times and in all places, Brother Joseph you have staid at our Home You kn[o]w what we are and how I with the rest of my family conducted ourselves— my natural disposition is Gay and lively, I am ever cheerful— I am Happy myself and try to make others so— at times pe[r]haps I say and do my litrlre [literal?] things from the impu[l]se of the mom[e]nt— that were I to take a second though[t] I would not do Levity is my lasting sin! Please submit this to the Corim [Quorum] of the Twelve— and my God dirrect you in adminstrg [administering] Justice to the oppressed
I rem[ai]n Your Sister in the Gospl of Chrrst Sybella Armstrog [McMinn Armstrong] [p. [3]]
<PHILADELPHIA. Pa MAY 2>
<MONMOUTH Ills. MAY 15>
<PAID> <25>
Joseph Smith Junr
Nauvoo. Hanokk <Hancock> Cou[n]ty Illinois
Sybbella, Armstrong. May 1st 1843 against B. Wincheter
<take his Licence from him. says Joseph> [p. [4]]
Young Benjamin Winchester at age 16 was one of the youngest to be on Zion’s Camp with the Prophet Joseph Smith. He was a hard working a faithful young man and loved the church very much. It is very sad on what happened to Benjamin.
This letter above along with the statement above by George J. Adams saying ,“Joseph and Hyrum said that Winchester was rotten at heart, would apostatize, and injure the church as much as he could”, are telling signs of why Benjamin was excommunicated and his Elder’s license was removed from him as told to the church in the in the Times and Seasons newspaper. Wow how embarrassing.
More Neville
Jonathan Neville wrote, “Last Thursday, Feb 16, the Joseph Smith Papers released new content, including documents from January through March 1843.
Those who have read my books The Lost City of Zarahemla and Brought to Light will be interested to see the full letter from Peter Hess to Hyrum Smith, Joseph, and the Twelve regarding Benjamin Winchester. Here’s an excerpt from the postscript on page 4:
“Brother Joseph i would here mention that Elder Winchester Prophecied before Elder Adams that the church would go down and you Know when a man phopecies [sic] in his own name he will use every means to see it accomplishd [sic].”
Here is a link to the letter http://www.josephsmithpapers.org/paper-summary/letter-from-peter-hess-16-february-1843/1
More on Benjamin Winchester by Jonathan Neville is here: http://www.moronisamerica.com/evolution-of-seer-stone-narrative-benjamin-winchester/
