Nephite interpreters
We have so much evidence in scripture that the two stones found in the stone box with the breastplate and the gold plates, were indeed the Urim and Thummim or as the Nephites called them, “Interpreters“, with which Joseph Smith translated the Book of Mormon. These original two stones came directly touched from the Lord, as given to the Brother of Jared and commanded to seal them up until later. See Ether 4:5
Joseph also translated other works, including the Bible. (Joseph Smith said, “I inquired of the Lord through the Urim and Thummim and received from him the following.” (Note: See the preface to the Doctrine and Covenants 3,6,7,11,14,15,16,17 and History of the Church V.1 p.45).
These Interpreters were also used to warn Joseph, or to see things in vision, or to protect the plates. For example, Lucy Mack Smith in her personal history quotes Joseph saying, “How marvelous are these spectacles as I can see ‘everything.'” There is not even one scripture that says a single seer stone was ever used to translate the Book of Mormon.
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Joseph’s vision with the Urim and Thummim
Lucy Mack Smith said, “Joseph kept the Urim and Thummim constantly about his person, by the use of which he could in a moment tell whether the plates were in any danger. Just before Emma rode up to Mrs. Wells, Joseph, from an impression that he had had, came up out of the well in which he was laboring, and met her not far from the house. Emma immediately informed him of what had transpired, whereupon he looked in the Urim and Thummim, and saw that the Record was as yet safe.” Lucy Mack Smith Journal History Chapter 23
A Single Stone?
There is however the single word “a stone” found in Alma 37:23, saying, “And the Lord said: I will prepare unto my servant Gazelem, a stone, which shall shine forth in darkness unto light, that I may discover unto my people who serve me, that I may discover unto them the works of their brethren, yea, their secret works, their works of darkness, and their wickedness and abominations.” By removing just a comma from the words in blue above, it should read, Joseph Smith a Seer. I explain the meaning of this scripture in my blog here:
Book of Mormon Hard Evidence Proper Translation
Above is a PDF with many Scriptures that say Joseph Smith used the Interpreters.
Download a copy here: https://bookofmormonevidence.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/06/Book-of-Mormon-Hard-Evidence-Proper-Translation.pdf
The Urim and Thummim consists of two seer stones or interpreters used by selected prophets throughout the ages. In ancient Israel the stones were part of the breastplate worn by the high priest of the Aaronic Priesthood. According to lds.org the Urim and Thummim is “an instrument prepared of God to assist man in obtaining revelation from the Lord and in translating languages.” The website also states that the name Urim and Thummim is Hebrew for “lights and perfections” and that “there is more than one Urim and Thummim, but we are informed that Joseph Smith had the one used by the brother of Jared” (See D&C 17:1).
John the Revelator and the Interpreters
Historical Background
The future of the Apostle John, sometimes called “the Beloved” or “the Revelator,” is a mystery to the world. Confusion comes because of the statement in John 21:20–23. Referring to John and speaking to Peter, the Savior said: “If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me. Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple [John] should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?”
From this statement questions naturally arise: Did John die? If not, what is his status? If he did, why did Jesus make the statement? The issue has been debated for centuries among the various Christian denominations, with some scholars saying that he indeed died and was buried at Ephesus, while others believe he still walks the earth. A third school of thought states that even though he was buried at Ephesus, he is not really dead but simply sleeps in the grave until the Second Coming of the Savior. (See Sperry Compendium, pp. 66–67.)
Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery finally solved the issue through an appeal to the Lord. The Prophet Joseph Smith recorded: “During the month of April [1829, at Harmony, Pennsylvania,] I continued to translate, and he [Oliver Cowdery] to write, with little cessation, during which time we received several revelations. A difference of opinion arising between us about the account of John the Apostle, mentioned in the New Testament, as to whether he died or continued to live, we mutually agreed to settle it by the Urim and Thummim.” (History of the Church, 1:35–36.)
Editors note: In the Scripture Index link above, it is says this about the Urim and Thummim. “There is more than one Urim and Thummim, but we are informed that Joseph Smith had the one used by the brother of Jared (Ether 3:22–28; D&C 10:1; 17:1). (See Seer.) A partial description is given in JS—H 1:35. Joseph Smith used it in translating the Book of Mormon and in obtaining other revelations.”
In the heading of D&C Section 7 it says, “Revelation given to Joseph Smith the Prophet and Oliver Cowdery, at Harmony, Pennsylvania, April 1829, when they inquired through the Urim and Thummim as to whether John, the beloved disciple, tarried in the flesh or had died. The revelation is a translated version of the record made on parchment by John and hidden up by himself.”
No where in the Book of Mormon are the words “Urim and Thummim”. Instead it only says Interpreters, or Nephite Interpreters. When ever Interpreters are mentioned it has a plural meaning. For example it does not say an interpreter, as if it was a single stone. In the D&C it does mention Urim and Thummim but that always has a dual meaning as in “two” stones not one. It doesn’t say Joseph used the “Urim” without the “Thummim”
“Joseph Smith received the same Urim and Thummim had by the Brother of Jared for it was the one expressly provided for the translation of the Jaredite and Nephite records. (D. & C. 10: 1; 17:1; Ether 3:22- 28.) It was separate and distinct from the one had by Abraham and the one had by the priests in Israel. The Prophet also had a seer stone which was separate and distinct from the Urim and Thummim, and which (speaking loosely) has been called by some a Urim and Thummim.” Mormon Doctrine page 576 under title Urim and Thummim and (Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, vol. 3, pp. 222-226.)
“Why do we not have more disclosure concerning the process of translation of the Book of Mormon? Perhaps the full process was not disclosed because we would not be ready to understand it, even if given. Perhaps, too, the Lord wanted to leave the Book of Mormon in the realm of faith, though it is drenched with intrinsic evidence. After all, Christ instructed Mormon, who was reviewing the Savior’s own teachings among the Nephites, not to record all of them on the plates because “I will try the faith of my people” (3 Ne. 26:11). Perhaps the details of translation are withheld also because we are intended to immerse ourselves in the substance of the book rather than becoming unduly concerned with the process by which we received it.” Elder Neal A. Maxwell https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1997/01/by-the-gift-and-power-of-god?lang=eng
“The result of Joseph and Oliver’s inquiry is given in the heading of section 7, which says,
“Revelation given to Joseph Smith the Prophet and Oliver Cowdery, at Harmony, Pennsylvania, April 1829, when they inquired through the Urim and Thummim as to whether John, the beloved disciple, tarried in the flesh or had died. The revelation is a translated version of the record made on parchment by John and hidden up by himself.”
Student Manual continues, It is not known whether Joseph saw the parchment referred to and was given power to translate it, or if its contents were revealed to Joseph without his seeing the original source. It makes no difference, since the material was given by revelation to the Prophet.
Notes and Commentary
D&C 7:1–3
See 3 Nephi 28:1–7 for a similar account of the Nephite disciples’ receiving the same gift because they had the same desires as John.
D&C 7:2. What Does It Mean to Have “Power over Death”?
This passage does not refer to the fact that a person would never die, for all must die (see 1 Corinthians 15:22). Even Christ died, though he had power over death (see John 10:17–18). To one who has power over death, death is held in abeyance according to the will of God (see Matthew 16:28; Mark 9:1; Luke 9:27; 3 Nephi 28:7–8). Such persons are called translated beings (see 3 Nephi 28:1–40; McConkie, Mormon Doctrine,pp. 804–8).
The Prophet Joseph Smith said that “translated bodies cannot enter into rest until they have undergone a change equivalent to death. Translated bodies are designed for future missions.” (History of the Church, 4:425; for further discussion of translated beings see Smith, Teachings, pp. 170–71; Taylor, Mediation and Atonement, pp. 74–78.)
D&C 7:3–6. How Has John Prophesied before Nations and Ministered to Heirs of Salvation?
Five of the books of the Bible were written by John: the Gospel of John, three epistles, and the book of Revelation. The world’s most widely distributed book is the Bible, portions of which have been translated into 2,233 languages as of 2000. It has been estimated that between 1815 and 1999 some 3.88 billion Bibles were printed (see Guinness World Records 2000, p. 138). Certainly John’s written prophecy has gone forth among the nations.
The Apostle John ministered to the Prophet Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery in 1829 when he assisted Peter and James in the restoration of the Melchizedek Priesthood (see D&C 27:12).
In a conference of the Church on 3 June 1831, the Prophet Joseph Smith taught concerning John’s ministry: “John the Revelator was then among the Ten Tribes of Israel who had been led away by Shalmaneser, king of Assyria, to prepare them for their return from their long dispersion” (History of the Church, 1:176).
Elder Heber C. Kimball recorded an appearance of John in the Kirtland Temple:
“When the Prophet Joseph had finished the endowments of the First Presidency, the Twelve and the Presiding Bishops, the First Presidency proceeded to lay hands upon each one of them to seal and confirm the anointing; and at the close of each blessing the whole of the quorums responded to it with a loud shout of Hosanna! Hosanna! etc.
“While these things were being attended to the beloved disciple John was seen in our midst by the Prophet Joseph, Oliver Cowdery and others.” (In Whitney, Life of Heber C. Kimball, pp. 91–92.)
D&C 7:7. What Are the Keys Held by Peter, James, and John?
“The keys of the ministry which John says (Sec. 7:7) were given to Peter, James and himself, constituted the authority of Presidency of the Church in their dispensation. (See D.H.C., Vol. 3:387; Matt. 17:1–9; D. & C. 81:1–2.) These keys were given at the transfiguration to these three Apostles, and they in turn gave them to Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery in this dispensation. (D. & C. 27:12–13; 128:20.)” (Smith, Church History and Modern Revelation, 1:49.)
Doctrine and Covenants Student Manual (2002), 17–18
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/manual/doctrine-and-covenants-student-manual/section-7-john-the-revelator?lang=eng
Many Times the Urim and Thummim was Used to Translate
“In this respect the testimony of Lorenzo Brown about the preparation the Prophet made for his translation of the Bible may be instructive. He records the Prophet as saying: “After I got through translating the Book of Mormon, I took up the Bible to read with the Urim and Thummim. I read the first chapter of Genesis and I saw the things as they were done. I turned over the next and the next, and the whole passed before me like a grand panorama; and so on chapter after chapter until I read the whole of it. I saw it all!” (as cited in Matthews, Plainer Translation, 25).” The Process of Translating the Book of Mormon Joseph Fielding McConkie (Professor of Ancient Scripture, BYU) Craig J. Ostler (Assistant Professor of Church History and Doctrine, BYU)
10 things we know about the Urim and Thummim
- The earliest mention of the Urim and Thummim is in connection with the brother of Jared. The Lord told him to keep a record of certain sacred things and to seal the record up. (We have that record in the book of Ether.) “And behold, these two stones will I give unto thee, and ye shall seal them up also with the things which ye shall write” (Ether 3:23). That same Urim and Thummim was used by Joseph Smith in translating the Book of Mormon.
In the passage that follows, we read that the Lord “showed unto the brother of Jared all the inhabitants of the earth which had been, and also all that would be; and he withheld them not from his sight, even unto the ends of the earth” (Ether 3:25). The record is not clear, but very possibly the Urim and Thummim was used in giving that great vision to the brother of Jared.
- Abraham used the Urim and Thummim in receiving a vision of the order of heaven. “And I, Abraham, had the Urim and Thummim, which the Lord my God had given unto me, in Ur of the Chaldees; And I saw the stars, that they were very great, and that one of them was nearest unto the throne of God” (Abraham 3:1–2).
- Aaron followed the commandment of God in putting “in the breastplate the Urim and Thummim” (Leviticus 8:8).
- When Joshua succeeded Moses, he was commanded to “stand before Eleazar the priest, who shall ask counsel for him after the judgment of Urim before the Lord” (Numbers 28:21).
- On one occasion when David was warring with Saul, he apparently used the Urim and Thummim to determine what would happen. (See 1 Samuel 23:9–12; the breastplate bearing the Urim and Thummim was attached to the ephod.)
- Saul sought revelation from the Lord when the Philistines were preparing to attack. “And when Saul inquired of the Lord, the Lord answered him not, neither by dreams, nor by Urim, nor by prophets” (1 Samuel 28:6).
- In the time of Ezra, certain Levites could not prove their right to the priesthood. They were therefore barred from priestly privileges “till there stood up a priest with Urim and Thummim” to discern the truthfulness of their claim” (Ezra 2:63). It is likely that no one with the Urim and Thummim ever appeared to settle the dispute.
- In the Book of Mosiah, King Limhi took the Jaredite plates to King Mosiah, who “translated them by the means of those two stones which were fastened into the two rims of a bow” (Mosiah 28:13). Mosiah later passed the Urim and Thummim on to Alma the younger, who eventually gave them to his son Helaman.
- Not only did Joseph Smith use the Urim and Thummim to translate the Book of Mormon, but he also used it to receive revelation from God. Specifically, Doctrine and Covenants sections 3, 6, 11, and 14 were all given through the Urim and Thummim.
- We learn from the Doctrine and Covenants that “the place where God resides is a great Urim and Thummim.” In addition, “this earth, in its sanctified and immortal state, will be made like unto crystal and will be a Urim and Thummim to the inhabitants who dwell thereon.” And each person who receives the white stone mentioned in Revelation 2:17 will be able to use the Urim and Thummim (D&C 130:8–10).
http://www.ldsliving.com/10-Things-We-Know-About-the-Urim-and-Thummim/s/90115
